A Small Annoyance
I try to keep my annoyances just that - annoyances and not a full blown hissy fit. Anger is not healthy for alcoholics, or anyone else for that matter.
Every Sunday in our parish after the lector reads the General Intercessions, the congregation is asked to add their own personal intentions. What ensues is a quagmire of people either talking at the same time or mumbling so that you have no idea what you just lent your prayers to, or saying things of such a personal nature that you just cringe. This goes on for a considerable time. I particularly like the gal who every week prays for the return of her children to the faith. Two prayers later a fellow prays for the same thing. He is either not listening or thinks her prayer is just not up to snuff. This goes on week after week.
The New Liturgical Movement has a post and about a gazillion comments on this subject, so it must be on other people's minds as well. The GIRM doesn't state specifically whether this is not to be done.
I posted a poll on the sidebar because I am interested in how many other parishes engage in this practice. If you don't have time to post a comment (always appreciated), please do take the time to click on yes or no.
Saturday Update: The one yes vote on the poll is mine. LOL
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29 comments:
While I voted No there is a caveat. There is a notebook for entering one's personal intentions kept on a side altar (not a Mass Altar). This notebook is brought forward during the entrance procession and the intentions within it are included during the Prayers of the Faithful with the spoken intention "for all the intentions included in the Book of Intentions, let us...." (a la rememberesnces in the Book of the Dead in November). Peoples prayer needs are met and the unending litany of personal prayers are avoided. (My personal pet peeve is the intention "For My Personal Intention". If the intention is personal keep it that way!)
We sort of do the same thing. we have a prayer basket that is at the foot of the altar.
We also do something else that amoutns to a moment of silence for our personal intentions too, but no one blurts anything out loud.
If it's not forbidden, I can accept "different strokes for different folks" -- even something I personally do not like.
This actually is forbidden the rubrics state that, "The intentions are announced from the ambo or from another suitable place, by the deacon or by a cantor, a lector, or one of the lay faithful.
The people, however, stand and give expression to their prayer either by an invocation said together after each intention or by praying in silence."
Nowhere are motions from the floor anticipated.
AA - We have a notebook but it just sits in the back of the church. It is never included in the Prayers of the Faithful.
emily - That would work....
Irene - It is not suggested in the GIRM either - so I wonder...
Father Richtsteig -
"motions from the floor" --- good one.
I remember the Sunday a lady went into excruciating detail about her son's drug addiction - definitely too much information
That was my take on the GIRM. Seemed pretty clear to me.
we don't have it at Sunday mass but often during the week the Priest invites people to say their own prayers.
stirring the pot again.
we don't do it here, and i would definitely object if we started. such confusion distracts from the action on the altar.
No, not lately. When we first moved back here, we went to the Beloved's childhood parish and the rainbow-clad deacon in charge of the cluster (an old, ill priest was the "sacramental minister") did that. He also asked newcomers/people visiting to introduce themselves before Mass. I ignored this (because I was on my knees praying before Mass, mind you) and he walked down the aisle and said it again, loudly, grinning and pointing down at me. I was appalled. He asked where I was from, I told him, just as loudly, that we'd just moved here from San Diego, "where people are allowed to pray quietly before Mass."
Not a big hit with my mother in law, but I mean, COME ON!!!
Uncle Jim - I LOVE to stir the pot and run like hell............
Kit - oh Lordy - I wish I could have been there to see that. Too funny!
Our Parish does not do this and my mom's parish only does it during daily Mass Mon-Fri and probably because they only get about 10 people at the daily (my mom included) as it is a very small town.
wow, open prayer time at Mass, huh? That sounds sort of well... wierd lol
Not that it hasn't been said better already, but, by definition they are GENERAL intercessions for the needs of the church. The are not called the personal intercesstions.
Le me understand this correctly. The personal intentions of the mass in your parish are spoken out loud?? My gosh. Absolutely incredible.
In some respects, I actually feel pity for some of those folks. I can imagine hearing a supplication for the healing of a loved one once in a while. But the proper way of doing this - at least in all the Catholic Churches I've attended - is to pray your intentions silently. Never have I witnessed a hodgepodge of voices trying to be heard. Again, the responsible party here for this type of gaucherie is the pastor of the parish.
Could you give this a little publicity please:
Saint Conleth’s Catholic Heritage Association invites you to honour the Holy Year of St. Paul by attending Holy Mass in the Traditional Latin Rite (Missal of Blessed John XXIII) on Saturday, 30th August, 2008, at 11 a.m., in St. Paul’s Church, Emo, Co. Laois, Ireland, followed by a tour of Emo Court House and Gardens.
For the past 15 years, St. Conleth’s Catholic Heritage Association has been working prayerfully for the provision of the Traditional Latin Liturgy in the Diocese of Kildare and Leighlin.
Please confirm your attendance to: catholicheritagegroup@catholic.org
For further details consult:
www.catholicheritage.blogspot.com
God bless you!
Saint Conleth’s Catholic Heritage Association
At my parish this is absolutely not done. The Carmelite Priests are VERY strict followers of the GIRM and the Roman Missal.
This practice is absolutely forbidden, even if the intention is good
We are only allowed to do it during weekday Mass. We usually have the same 30 hardcores out for it. It's usually the same 5 people praying and the intentions are always succintly worded. Example "we pray for an increase in vocations to the priesthood and religoius life" or "for the unborn and their mothers" or "for those suffering from cancer" or "those away from the faith that they will experience God's love for them." I am OK with it.
However.....we had a mentally ill lady in our parish for a time and she totally abused this. Eventually she left the parish. Father talked to her about - probably why she left. It got quite ugly but things have settled down.
angela m --
Lovely mantilla! Do you wear it regularly? If so, what is the reaction?
The mentally ill lady: brings to mind something about "...one of these my least brethren...". I really wouldn't want to be one of the goats on His left hand.
adrienne -- marvelous what your little question has elicited.
Irene, I bought it for a Latin Mass (my first!) that I will be going to at the end of August. Then I will probably put it away in a drawer. I live in a remote town and the nearest TLM is a 16 hour drive away. I would not wear a veil to my local NO. A hat maybe, but not a veil.
We say: "In the silence of your own hearts add your personal intentions" after the General Intercessions are read aloud by the Lector.
Saying intentions out loud should be banned because who knows what kind of dissident crazy stuff someone may come up with and then everyone, including Father, is on the spot. What if someone says: "Legalize pot!" or "We pray that GLBT persons can legally marry" Then what? How confusing is that? Esp. to the young. Well, I should say: to the poorly churched too.
We are asked to do so, but SILENTLY!
angela m.: it would be a shame to put it away. Just as a matter of art, of beauty, I think nothing is more beautiful than an attractive lady in a mantilla.
There is nothing impious about a mantilla -- neither at a TLM nor at a NO mass. Just as there is nothing impious about wearing a tie to both. Might start a trend.
Now I will have to admit I wear a T-shirt and jeans. But do as I say, not as I do.
Irene, I agree in principle but I would so self-conscious that I could not concentrate on the Mass and that would be wrong. If even ONE other lady wore one I would do it but until then....into the drawer with the veil.
Sometimes they ask us to SILENTLY put our intentions before the Lord. That's as close as we get. I haven't seen that since my Episcopal days... :-)
Now, I have a clarifying question: is something not being anticipated in the rubrics the same as it being forbidden?
And I have to add two things - sorry to hog the combox, Adrienne -
Kit - I wish I'd seen that comment before I did my 10 things I wished I'd seen in action meme...
Angela M. - it may be that there are other women who feel the same way as you do. Not trying to push you to do it, mind you, but it seems to me that it's likely that at least one other woman in your parish is thinking "If just ONE other woman wore one..."
Kasia - I'm going to have to refer you to Father Erik's comment. The option is not given for everyone to voice his or her intentions. We are to do what the rubrics call for and not make up things.
I can see it being done at a daily Mass with very few people even though it would still be wrong.
At a Sunday Mass with a couple hundred or more people it is cacophony and extremely distracting.
The other result of this practice is the majority never get to pray your own intentions. By the time everyone is through praying for rain and their nephews safe vacation it's time to move on.
angela - If you want to wear a mantilla - wear it. My favorite thing about mantillas is the sides hanging down which helps with distractions.
....and our daily Mass goers do the intentions in a general way like at your church. It's on Sunday that you hear the weird stuff. We have one little old lady (a very sweet women) who goes on and on praising God, giving thanks for whatever and 99% of it you can't hear.
I'm with you re: intentions. If they sound like anything the Democratic national committee wrote, I simply refuse to add my "Lord, hear our prayer." to it.
I really don't like people being allowed to go on and on during a large Sunday Mass. If there is something very specific to pray for like "pray for X,Y,Z people who are on our sick list" fine. But I don't need a blow-by-blow of what color their urine is. Ditto, recently deceased, or if we're going to pray for all the people who got wiped out in the latested flood/hurricane/fire okay.
This "pray for" list really shouldn't take longer than 2 minutes MAX. A minute or less is better!
KAren
angela m. -- in our parish, at our 4 pm NO mass (which I attend because it is the only one that is signed), we have one little slightly overweight lady of about 80 years who ALWAYS wears something on her head, Sometimes it is a handkerchief, sometimes a knapkin, sometimes something I don't recognize. Every other woman at that mass dresses informally, but she faithfully/obstinately has something on her head every week. Then she takes communion in the hand.
Your mantilla should help you concentrate. Try it and see if that is not so.
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